Part 13

Half-past Eleven, P.M.

I have just received the enclosed answer from Townshend; and though it contains nothing, yet I cannot but feel too much for your impatience to delay till Wednesday night the acknowledging your despatches, and the assuring you that there shall be no remissness whatever on my part to follow up this business as much as possible, and to press it forward in this strange scene of procrastination. Nothing can make me happier than your approbation of my conduct, and your kind disposition to trust so much to that most unfeigned affection with which I am,

My dearest brother, Ever yours, W. W. Grenville.

P.S.--I mean to-morrow to write to Lord Shelburne, stating that you have sent over a fresh despatch to Mr. Townshend, and referring him to that for the absolute necessity of adopting your proposal, which still leaves room for his settlement, if it is thought proper and expedient. The one will remove the present difficulty, the other prevent the rise of any fresh source of discord. But how far the latter can or ought at this time to be taken up, is with me very doubtful. If I get on Wednesday such an answer as I wish, you shall see me very soon.

MR. W. W. GRENVILLE TO LORD TEMPLE.

Pall Mall, Dec. 20th, 1782.

My dear Brother,

I am still unable to send you any final answer, although I must confess that I think we approach much nearer to it than we have done yet.

The Cabinet met yesterday. As I was not quite satisfied with what I had said the day before on the subject of recognition, and of the preamble, I thought it better to put a few words to paper, and to send them to Townshend. I enclose a copy of that paper and the letter which went with it. They were delivered to Townshend during the Cabinet. I heard nothing at all from him last night.

This morning I was surprised and shocked--and I cannot say which I was most--by seeing in the papers the conversation which had passed in the House on the subject of Ireland, of which Fitzpatrick, though it was evidently a concerted thing, had not thought proper to give me any notice whatever. I immediately resolved to say something about it in the House to-day. Accordingly I sent a note to Townshend, desiring to be allowed to wait upon him in the morning. I told him my intention, and questioned him upon the subject of the Cabinet. He showed me, what (he said) was not properly a minute, but a memorandum taken there. I could not copy that, but as soon as I came home I endeavoured to recollect it, and believe the enclosed is very near the words. This I said immediately was only losing time, and that it was very useless for him to trouble himself with writing such a despatch, as I would take upon myself to make your answer to the two points it contained: First, that the bill you had sent over was drawn expressly to avoid the question of what had been the right, as it declared only what is now the right; and that if there was to be any reservation as to its being now the right, I would only say that this would be the most disgraced country in Europe. As to the other point, I knew perfectly that every step you had taken was with a full knowledge of the circumstances of the case, because I had sent them over to you myself a few days after my arrival in London. That being the case, Townshend said he would not write, but state these things to the Cabinet, which was to meet again either to-morrow or the next day; I do not positively remember which. I then stated to him what I meant to say to-day, in which he acquiesced. He told me General Conway wished to see me, as he thought that he had struck out an idea which might answer effectually; and he showed me a few words which were to explain this idea. They were in the form of a resolution, and went only to say, that Great Britain had, by the repeal, renounced all thoughts of exercising any right to make laws to bind Ireland. You may easily guess the answer which I made to this.

From Townshend I went to Conway. Him I found very strongly impressed with Lord B.'s ideas about renunciation, complete satisfaction, and the effect of a declaratory law, and of the repeal of it, which, he said, left things as they were before. I combated all this very strongly, and at last got him to acquiesce in the idea of a recognition, provided that the words were such as not to imply that England never had the right. I said that I conceived, as this was merely a point of honour, and not a reservation of anything to be exercised in future, that all that Government could desire was to use such words as should not necessarily imply that the right never existed; that this was expressly the description of the words in your bill, which were so drawn as to go only to present right, and yet so as to be very satisfactory to Ireland. In all this he acquiesced, and then wished that some notice might be given in the "Dublin Gazette;" that the cause had only been heard because it was pending before; and that after the holidays, something satisfactory would be done. I answered as to the first, that after the opinion delivered privately by the Chancellor, and in the House of Commons, as I had understood, by the Attorney-General, that even a new cause could not be rejected by the Judges, such a ground would be a very bad one to take. To this he agreed. As to the other point, I said that it was my intention to state it in the House of Commons, which I apprehended would answer nearly the same purpose. He assented to this also, and so I left him. I then went to the House of Commons; there I saw Townshend, and asked him what day the Parliament was to meet after Christmas, because I thought it would give more solemnity if I gave notice for a particular day, and moved for a call on that day; and that the earlier it was, the better it would be. He said they met on the 21st. I proposed that day, and he agreed. Hartley rose at the same time with me, and being called to, moved for a call on the 22nd. I then got up and said, that if I had not been prevented, I was going to have moved it for the 21st; but I would now trouble the House only to give notice that on that day a very important business would be brought before them on the subject of Ireland; that I had understood that a conversation had taken place the day before on that subject; that I lamented exceedingly that I had been so unfortunate as to be absent at that time, because if I had been there I should have thought it my duty to have stated to the House, in justice to the Lord-Lieutenant of Ireland, that the business in question had been submitted by you to the consideration of Government, and had been in the contemplation of the King's servants a considerable time before any notice had been given of a motion to be made upon it by a noble Lord in the House; that I wished further, in justice to you, to say, that "there was no man in either kingdom more decidedly of opinion that the good faith of Great Britain was solemnly pledged to Ireland, by the repeal of the 6th Geo. I., in the last sessions, upon the avowed and explained principle of putting an end to every idea of legislation and jurisdiction over that kingdom; and that there was no man more eagerly desirous than you, that that faith so pledged, and upon that principle so explained, should be religiously adhered to and maintained, as the national honour and national interest required it should be maintained, sacred and inviolable."

This brought up Lord Beauchamp, who began by assuring and protesting that the part he had taken was upon the best motives, &c., &c. He then went into the question of the writ of error, how far it could have been rejected, and how useless it was in Ireland, &c., &c. He then said that it was a point of parliamentary fairness, that when one person had given notice of a motion, it should be left to him, and not taken up in the meantime by any other person.

I answered, that as to the noble Lord's motives, he must do me the justice to say that I had been perfectly silent on that head. That with respect to the question about the writ of error, neither did I conceive this to be a proper time for that discussion. But that with regard to parliamentary fairness, I did not imagine that His Majesty's Government would think themselves justified in postponing so important a question, and which would have been brought on before the recess if there had been time, merely because the noble Lord meant to move something about it at a distant day.

This ended the conversation on the subject; except that I added that the noble Lord had misunderstood me when he imagined that I was to move the business on the 21st, as I apprehended that it was the intention of Government to do it.

I cannot help thinking that by this, which has been done entirely without the concurrence or even knowledge of Lord Shelburne, we have gained a great point. By giving such a notice, speaking from the Treasury bench in the hearing of, and backed by Townshend and Pitt, I have most undoubtedly pledged Government to do something on that day. If that is short of your wishes, see in what a situation they stand; if not, you are landed. In the meantime the notice and the explicit declaration made in your name must surely be infinitely useful to you in Ireland.

I wait with great impatience the final decision of the Cabinet. Conway's expression was, that he conceived there was no objection to any preamble which had not a retrospect. If we can convince them that ours has none, or frame one not quite so strong, but very near it, think what ground we stand upon, in having obtained something stronger and more advantageous to the interests of Ireland than any renunciation whatever. "For this we must thank" Mansfield, who has certainly extricated us from a scene of considerable difficulty.

If it could be done without great inconvenience to you in Ireland, I should be very desirous either of coming back here, in case I get away soon enough, or if not, of staying here till the 21st; because I am convinced my presence here is of infinite moment, to prevent their being frightened at the time into any weakening of the preamble, and to goad them on to do something. For you see, even in this case, the objection was not so much to the taking any particular step, as to the doing anything at all; and when forced to that, and driven from their intrenchments of indolence and delay, you see how much they are inclined to take the measures you wish. But this shall be decided by your wishes on the subject, unless I should set out before I receive them.

I say nothing of the dissolution; I have not, however, lost sight of that, and will press it to-morrow; but I thought the other the more important point, having so fine an opening, which I trust you will think I have not neglected.

D'Ivernois is come. He was with me this morning, and comes again to-morrow. He says the business goes on at Geneva far better than he could have expected, owing to the Constitution which the mediating powers have given them, which appears truly, what he states it, worse than that of Venice.

Believe me, my dear brother, Ever most affectionately yours, W. W. G.

MR. W. W. GRENVILLE TO LORD TEMPLE.

Pall Mall, Dec. 23rd, 1782.

My dear Brother,

When I wrote last to you, I expressed considerable hopes that this tedious business was drawing near to a conclusion, and that Government here would at last consent to grant the happiness and peace of Great Britain and Ireland, to solicitations that I should have been ashamed to have employed for any private object, however near to me. These hopes are, I must confess, weakened by my conversation of this morning with Townshend. I can plainly see that he is himself personally disposed to comply with your wishes. I can as plainly see that a greater and more powerful minister sets himself against them.

Dec. 24th, 1782.

So far I had written yesterday, when I resolved to delay writing further to you till to-day, on account of the promise which Townshend gave me that he would see Lord Shelburne last night, and press him upon the subject.

I have been with Townshend again this morning, and yet have nothing like a decided answer to give you. He told me that Thurlow made the most difficulty, but that Dunning seems to be entirely with us. Yesterday he said that Shelburne talked much of the advantages of holding high language. What the tenor of Conway's language was, I have stated to you before. Of the rest I know nothing. I own I am rather in doubt whether Lord Shelburne acts upon a system of resuming, or only of gaining time; neither of them is very pleasant or flattering to you.

Townshend appears to me to be most heartily and sincerely with you; nothing can be more explicit than his language was to that point. He complained of irresponsible Cabinet Ministers, and seemed to throw it upon that. I then stated your impatience, what you must feel, and asked how you could go on? I took out of my pocket your three letters to me, of the 12th and 14th instant, and read him such extracts as I thought would express your opinion and your impatience, and would pretty strongly imply though not express your determination upon the subject of resigning. He took the hint, and said that he could not wonder at any resolution you might take, and that he had told the Cabinet so. To this I answered, that it was right for me not to conceal from him (though I did not mean it as a formal declaration), that you certainly would not stay a moment there, if you found the proposal of a Bill of recognition either negatived or put off longer. He repeated that he could not wonder at it. He then charged me with a commission to write to you this evening, and to say that although nothing was yet done, he would labour to the utmost of his power that your wishes should be complied with, and that he hoped to bring the business to a conclusion in a very few days; that in the meantime he thought that his writing an official despatch, which should not be explicit, would be by no means pleasant to you. In this I agreed most fully.